Becoming the best Salesperson you can be with Marcus A. Chan

[00:00:00] Brad Seaman: Yeah. That’s that’s. That’s awesome. So, so let’s transition a little bit. So tell us about today. Tell us about the business. Who do you, who do you go? Who do you go after in terms of, you know, I know you talked a little bit about the clients that you have, but and how you got there, but, you know, tell us about the, you know, tell us about the, maybe some of the tactics or anything you’re specifically past.

[00:00:21] Marcus Chan: Yeah. So yeah, I mean, I love what I do now. I mean, not that I didn’t love what I did before, but now it’s like, I’m going to I’m a firm believer, like when you truly master selling your serving at the highest possible level, it’s like when you have a really good offer solution, you can really impact the other person, that business owner, whoever he’s talking to, the CFO, the CC, whatever.

So I’m passionate about it also. No. Because I had pretty good success with B2B sales in my career. It transformed my life. It put me in position to do whatever I want, and I feel incredibly blessed for that. So now I get to help people do exact same thing. And typically people I’m working with clients or like they’re used like account executives, sound like SDRs BDRs are like top of the funnel work.

Is

[00:01:05] Brad Seaman: this more coaching or is there a service component to this?

[00:01:08] Marcus Chan: So it’s high-performance coaching, right? So like people go into my program, they’re typically going to my group coaching and course program, which is a high ticket offer. So they go into that type of solution and they’re able to transform their results from a to Z.

So ideally they have a little bit experience, you know, at least this way, or we have some, some basis to work with why, but if they don’t no worries, but they’ve been in sales for a long time, as long as. Egotistical. They’re going to be able to learn and get some pretty fast results too. So it’s been it’s been pretty awesome.

I mean, it we’ve been in business now for over, over to silver, to to silver two years now, but we’re now in as Thomas recording with the end of October. So just over two years now, some who brought in over 300 plus clients. I mean, now we would feature. Forbes marked a

[00:01:49] Brad Seaman: watch. Oh yeah. So I saw you’re making, you’re making, you’re making your waves are around on the, on the economic, some of the magazines do you have, so here’s my question.

When you think about your competence, like when you think about who you compete with, are you CA are you competing with some of these, you know, there’s schools that have launched in on, I can’t think of some of the names, but there’s a handful of these kind of SDR and sales and sales reps school. I hope you get, yeah, I’ll take you through the bootcamp and then to help you get, get a job and then you pay back as you, is it kind of like that?

[00:02:21] Marcus Chan: No, those are so I don’t really compete with those. I mean, those are like, they usually have like those like ISA income share agreements, et cetera. I think those are really cool. Cause those, a lot of them are designed for like, Hey, how do you get to tech sales? Right. For most of them it’s like, You know, you, you either you pay him a certain percentage or you pay a certain amount and you joined the program and they help you find a job, which I think is that’s a, that’s a great program for a lot of people.

I don’t really compete with them. In fact, I partner up with some of them before, because sometimes it’s a good feeder program for them to go through that program. And then once they’re ready to really best themselves to go to my program, cause mine really takes them to the next level and really just supercharges everything they do.

So I don’t really compete

[00:02:58] Brad Seaman: with them. Gotcha. Okay. No, I was just trying to get my frame. I was trying to frame up the program. I was trying to understand, just kind of trying to figure out where, to, where to fit it. Right. In the, in the scheme. Do you think everybody can sell,

[00:03:09] Marcus Chan: Well, I believe they can learn how to sell, you know, like, can they sell by himself on a mathlete?

Not necessarily. I think most people, you know, they Alok certain frameworks to understanding how to be successful, but also more importantly, They lock the understanding of human and sales psychology. So I think the mistake a lot of people make is when they go into sales, they’re like, oh, you know what?

I’m outgoing. I’m likable people like me and yeah, they might, that might be good, but they may still lock Roy core fundamentals actually making truly great at sales. Wasn’t actually replicatable so like, for example, I suppose all in common. Oh, sorry, go ahead.

[00:03:47] Brad Seaman: No, you’re good. You’re good. You just, you got me, you you’re getting in my wheelhouse.

So things I’d like to talk about, so keep, keep going.

[00:03:52] Marcus Chan: Yeah. You know, I think like, for example, like, you know, it’s not uncommon. I see someone who maybe in one industry, they crushed it. They just go, it’s a different industry and then there’s. Because it’s not transferable what they were doing because foundationally, they weren’t really set well.

So there hasn’t maybe been some natural instincts on some natural lock that went in their favor, but once in a whole new industry, when they’re forced to actually prospect and close, they struggle. And I’ve seen across the board, people that have been selling for years, they’re like, oh man, like I was really crushing it here, but then they realized walls and lots of inbound leads.

As I’m booking my appointments for me. And now his new role to start up foundationally. We’re not set. No one’s booking my meetings. No one knows my company name. I gotta book my own meetings. My prosthetist is running super long. I never sold it to say healthcare space or education. The sales cycle is longer.

So there’s don’t know these things. So they actually ended up struggling and potentially even second guessing themselves. And they should maybe do something else. I see it all the time.

[00:04:49] Brad Seaman: Now do you think it’s in that situation, it’s better for you to, to take a time out and say, okay, what kind of sales am I good at?

And then to go, to try to put yourself in that situation, or would you encourage somebody to, like,

[00:05:03] Marcus Chan: I would say for someone it’s also affirmed believer your sins follow you everywhere. All right. And it’s kind of like relationships, right? Like, let’s just say, for example, like, you know, I’m married right now, which is awesome.

I’ve been married for over a decade now, but let’s just say if I’ve been married multiple times, nothing, nothing was anything wrong with it, but the consistent it keeps popping up is that I’m really selfish. Right. Okay. It costs like I’m only thinking about me and, and that’s a, that’s a cause of demise each relation.

You might find someone who doesn’t care that you’re selfish, right. But that’s your sickness carrying you around and look at sales the same way. Like if you’re missing core fundamentals, actually making truly grant sales, like for example, say active listening. See if you’re not a good active listener.

Well, that’s an a fall you’re everywhere you go. And yeah, for some process, maybe it’s a little bit easier, but I’d much rather make sure you have the right tool, the foundation, so you can really maximize your skill and your complex. Otherwise you’ll be capped based off the limits you have already based off your current.

[00:06:05] Brad Seaman: Was that a nice way to tell, tell me how to do to be a better active visitor. I

[00:06:10] Marcus Chan: must say that. I’ll just say call them as it

[00:06:14] Brad Seaman: is

what my kids, 12 years old, or my kid who’s 12 as a baby. He doesn’t ever wear any pants. He’s always got his diaper on and the pupil people used to come over and they’re like, we love how your kid doesn’t wear any pants, but I don’t think that was a couple of it. I think there are.

Okay, so, so active, so active listening. So I want, I want to hone in on that cause, cause I think the one thing that’s really important about selling, I think there’s two, I think curiosity is one and I think active listening is another. So I grew up in a family. I sort of learned this, this drove me crazy.

My dad was a counselor. He was a marriage family therapist. And so, so he would do, he would like active listening on us and it would drive me crazy. To this day, like if I get stuck in a, if I’m talking to somebody who’s been sailor, sand, Sandler, sales trained, and they start putting me in the pain funnel, I freak out I just started going crazy.

But I think the important thing is that you gotta be, you gotta intentional, you gotta be intention. You gotta actually care. So if you’re going through the Mo, if you’re active listening and you don’t care, it comes on. It’s kind of like. Chick-fil-A, I don’t know if they have those out in Portland or not, but they say MITRE, they say my pleasure.

And I caught somebody the other day said my pleasure and it was not authentic. And I go to Chick-fil-A a lot and I felt like I needed to get that. I didn’t, but I felt like I needed to get out of the car and be like, Hey, you know, don’t say it. If you don’t mean it, it’s like, I feel like the thing about Chick-fil-A is you feel it’s your restaurant or at least I do.

I feel like where they grew up. I feel like. Hey, this is my restaurant. If you’re going to say my pleasure, you have to meet it because when you say my pleasure and you really don’t care, it really it’s almost like it’s, it’s like saying it’s like, it’s like perfect. It’s like being perfect. So you’re basically cussing at the con.

So you got, so there’s a couple things that I think are really important in sales that you highlight the active listening. I think curiosity, you know, you gotta be curious and you gotta care. I think those are the three kind of core. Like when I think about a good sales person, I think about somebody. Cares about the client.

We say empathy, but I sorta think that gets like an old. Yeah, I feel like it’s overused. You got to care. You got to give a crap. You got to care about your, you know, it’s like you go to a restaurant and the gal behind the counter is making your beef taco. And she just like throw in the beef on there. It’s like, look, it shouldn’t make a difference.

How you threw that on. But it really does. Like, I struggled. You been like, it makes a difference. I’ll don’t

[00:08:43] Marcus Chan: you, when they wrap it in property, I’m like, come on.

[00:08:47] Brad Seaman: No, you’re a restaurant. You grew up with a restaurant. So you’re probably okay. So I think caring is really important. You’d call it empathy.

Can’t carry you, come and give it the crap, whatever you got to care about, what you’re doing, you gotta be a good listener and you gotta be curious. And I think when we think about selling, we typically think about. You nailed it. People like me, I’m a good talker. You know, I can communicate with none of that stuff really cares because you can grow if you’re, if you can grunt and you can ask questions, you can close deals, like I’ve closed some deals.

Like, I don’t always think of myself as being like the best communicator. I’m a really good ask her a question. So like, I can ask really good questions, but I don’t always communicate stuff effectively, but I’ve sold some really big stuff and I’ve gotten done and I’ve been there. I can’t believe these people bought, because I didn’t say anything.

I literally just like, I grew up. Through, I got, you know, I made some sounds, but I ask good questions and I think that’s super important as you got to be able to ask questions. So is there any, do you agree with those kind of three principles? And is there anything else you’d think about adding

[00:09:52] Marcus Chan: to that a hundred percent?

I agree. I mean, I believe those who it’s funny because I believe those who really are great at selling really had just mastered the art of asking. I think that’s what, when it breaks down to when you can rule, when you really bash the art of asking questions, I have found that I’m sure you’ve seen the same thing.

Like 90% of the time, if you just ask the right questions and if you don’t present your solution, they’re like, wow. I feel heard. I like you more now. Cause I’ve been talking I want to buy, I don’t know what you have to sell, but whatever it is, I probably need it because I feel hurt.

[00:10:25] Brad Seaman: Nobody ever talks.

If you let somebody talk, they always like you more.

[00:10:31] Marcus Chan: It’s a hundred percent true. It’s a hundred percent. I love

[00:10:33] Brad Seaman: that dude. It’s like really? Cause I got

[00:10:37] Marcus Chan: like, all right, cool. So I’m right here. I guess. You know what? I think you’re smaller. Right. And I think just the, even go back to the caring piece, like authentically caring, doing what’s right for.

Right. Doing what’s right for them because he truly cares. I’ll give you examples. So even yesterday I had this like great, right. You know, like very qualified process. We had a great conversation. In fact, I know if I wanted to, I could have closed them right. On the spot. Right. But because of what we discussed and they were still on a path of where they want to go with a career, I need the best thing for them was not to close them because if they went this alternative path for the career, my program would just wouldn’t make any sense.

So from there, I only pause. I’m like, Hey, listen, like, listen, there are red lights is what about the credit card? And just go, I’m like, I want you to pause. It takes some time to just think, think about where you want to go with your career in the next three to five years. Digest it. So we set have another call.

So this is where they have time to think. And they’re like super appreciated, like texting me. I thought, like, I can’t believe it did that. Like, wow. Like thank you so much. And like, it actually speaks of your, of your character. I’m like, yeah. I’m like, yeah, it’s been most importantly, it’s what’s best for them.

And when you can operate from that spectrum, you will sell at a greater level. You’ll serve better people and it’s better for your soul across the board.

[00:11:59] Brad Seaman: Yeah, I think it’s so easy. You know, it’s easy to get caught up. It doesn’t. Do you any good to when you sell somebody something there’s kind of 300? I think we’d mentioned this on, I was talking to a guy yesterday about this is that if you talk somebody into something, at some point they’re gonna, they’re going to be.

You know, they’re either going to be, they’re either going to man, they’re going to get upset or they’re going to want to get out and it’s not good for you. And it’s not good. It’s not good for. I mean, ultimately people best sell themselves is somebody who’s gotta be in when they buy, when they buy, when they buy something, it’s just not, it’s not good.

It’s not good for your heart either. If you’re, if

[00:12:37] Marcus Chan: you’re, if you’re, if you’re a good luck, human being, like, you know, when you’ve like tried to talk someone into something that, you know, you’re like, oh, I know they said yes, but I really don’t feel like really great about I’ve done it. Right. I’m like, God, like why that.

You know you know, so it’s like, you have to like slow down and like look yourself in the mirror. Like that’s why I find the best sales with the kind of ties as well. They know themselves so well. So they see these triggers. So they’re able to like stop themselves from pushing too hard and find the right balance to really be in the present in the moment to really serve the people and do what’s best for all.

[00:13:14] Brad Seaman: Yeah, no, I, I agree. So let me ask you this. If you take those three core things that we talked about, you know, care caring. So what, w what’d we say, like caring and then being interested, or, you know, having some, you know, being inquisitive Why is it? If you have those characteristics and you succeed in one area that there was wouldn’t cross over to another, because that does happen a lot.

Right. Guys selling one thing and it comes over another market and now he can’t be successful. Do you think it’s because, you know, in your analogy that you gave her the example you gave, like the person was doing things like lead generation and appointments and you know, to me, those are maybe different skillsets than what made him a good sales person at the end.

Like there was a new introduction attack. That he wasn’t doing, but w what’s your thought on that? How can you be good at one thing, have those core characteristics then move to something else and be totally not successful?

[00:14:05] Marcus Chan: Sure. Right. It could be a few different things. Right? So for example, sometimes even the belief that they have in that product, the company, that leadership is not the same level as.

So even like the conviction they have when they’re even asking questions or whatever, they’re not confident. They don’t know quite well. You know, and I see them sometimes where maybe they’ve been industry for a long time and they changed industries and it’s totally new to them. And they haven’t really taken the time to really understand the ideal customer profile, the right use cases, et cetera.

So they’re not hauling numbers and body, but also number two, the questions they have are not as good or as well structured as when they did before. Because at this point they done so many times. And now this new industry, they’re not the same way. So even though there’s nothing good questions, even how they do it in a, what they’re asking, they’re not as confident or they don’t feel as good.

That’s really key.

I’ll say a lead sources for sure. Could be a key as well. Like where the leads actually come from. You know, if they were primarily super hot warm leads versus now they’re not an okay. Leads to the ones, even if they’re just doing the closing portion or the discovery and close, they’re not as good leads to work off of.

Right. So sometimes the environment around them, it makes a little bit easier for them to succeed. So that’s why it’s not a common, like if you go to a go a well-structured company or they’re good lead flow, good, everything. And you’re just in that discovery, closing type role in a role you might do really well because you’re set to win.

And then you, you, you had those go course core skill sets. Then you go to new company and you’re like, okay. I’m I’m pretty good questions, but I need even better. So maybe like the skill level you had this last company is not giving me enough to be successful this new company, and you think crazy skills even more, which is also really key to give me complexity of the opportunity as well.

What you’re selling, maybe yourselves, something more sophisticated buyer, maybe it’s a more complex sales process. So obviously someone who’s going from SMB, small, you know, small to mid-market to sell enterprise opportunities. Because they’re not good with talking to the C level exec. They’re really good talking to the business owner who is doing say under 50 million in sales, but now they’re talking to the belly Dar companies that are doing 500 million plus, and now they’re like, I’m not comfortable.

I’m not in my own in my own skin here. It’s really hard. Also. There’s other things such as, for example, I think money beliefs are key too. If you have the wrong money beliefs, I can really impact your, how you sell as well. Like if you go in and you’re selling offer that before that you felt really comfortable, if you yourself were that shoes of that person, you’d buy two, maybe it’s $10,000 a year, $20,000 a year.

And now it’s a new solution. You’re selling is a quarter million. If you yourself, don’t fully believe it. And again, it’s very hard for you to have an alignment with how you actually buy things and how you sell to again, a disconnect. So you have to have alignment across the board from, you know, the skill, the offer, everything else to be able to be consistently successful, even in the new role, regardless of how good you are asking questions.

[00:17:05] Brad Seaman: Yeah. I think the, I think the one thing you said that the money beliefs, you know, when all of a sudden you get a sales guy who. Is selling something that’s beyond the amount of money they’ve ever seen before. Correct. Gets challenging. It’s like yeah, that can be, that can be a big

[00:17:21] Marcus Chan: thing. If you’ve only sold a four Pintos and now you’ll like, you know, you can go sell Maseratis.

Isn’t me incredibly hard for yourself. Like, yeah,

[00:17:32] Brad Seaman: you gotta to get your, you got to get your mind, mind around. It’s a, it’s a total different income range, all different,

[00:17:38] Marcus Chan: different, completely different people.

[00:17:39] Brad Seaman: I think sales cycle has a lot to do with that too. You know, if you, if you’re in a short sales cycle you’ve been successful, you meant a long sales cycle.

Oh, yeah, yeah. A hundred percent. You’re not getting the winds as fast as you need them. And, and then I think companies are always unfair and unrealistic on long sales cycles on terms of rep length and ROI. You know, they got a 12 months sales cycle, but they want you to sell 90 days in, right? Like, are you supposed to get that sale at 90 days?

Would usually add it to. 103 hundred 65 days to get a, to get them or sales, but it happens all the time. All right, well, we’re getting sorta, we’re getting down here to the end. This was awesome.