Succeeding in sales to succeeding as a manager with Emanuel Carpenter

part 2

[00:00:00] Brad Seaman: Sort of hopped around and talked about prospecting. And I want to talk about sales management inside sales management. And so let’s talk about, let’s talk about the book and I’m just going to give you the Florida teacher, 15, 20 minute class on, on, on inside sales management and how we get it, what people do, right.

What they do wrong. I know you and I talked a lot about the. SDR model of like taking STRs and then converting them into salespeople. I think that’s kind of the standard. so I just love to hear, hear your opinions on what people do, right? What people do wrong and why you wrote the book. I think that’s a big piece of what, what drove you to want to write the book?

And we talked, I know we highlighted that a little bit. Cause you were running, you were running kind of clap a little, you had written a privy previous book,

[00:00:44] Emanuel Carpenter: correct? Correct? Correct. Yeah. I wrote a book called brain dump about five years ago. while I was working as a BDR and it was mainly for the folks who were already BDRs, just looking to get better and grade the skills.

And so, I was, I was working as a BDR. I had, I was, I was like the top performing media are earning six figures. I would always get the BDR managers to, sit the newbies next to me and say, Hey, just sit there, listen to your manual. And if you have any questions, ask them questions. Right. And so officially be a team leader and I would help them through things like.

And then I would get to the point where I just got frustrated, you know, always dealing with the newbies, being their peer model and being their, their, a team leader. So I decided why don’t I just write a book? And that way, if they ask me any questions, I can just give them the book. And then after they read the book, if they still have questions, they can ask me questions.

So I just wrote them, all the things, which is why I call it, bring them. I said, let me just do a brain dump of all the

[00:01:47] Brad Seaman: things you still have. This.

[00:01:50] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah. Yeah. So I’ll still have brain. It it’s still available on Amazon. it was published in 2017, and yeah, people still buy it. It was, um, it was rated one of the top 69 prospecting books of all times by an organization called book authority.

And so it was still on their list. I think it was number 50 the last time I checked. So and so, so that was brain dump. And so recently. I had same thing happened. So first of all, I created a company called STR masterclass. I did that about three years ago and I was working that kind of a side hustle.

Essentially, it was just video learning. So I were prerecorded videos, teaching SDRs, how to get better at their jobs, how to leverage sequences and things of that nature. And then I would teach them how to get promoted to the next level as well, be it to an eight E role or to a management role. I would have a course called SDR to SDR manager, STR AAE manager.

Then I would teach them things like how to go outside the box to find leads and prospect and do their outbounding and objection handling. So I pretty much covered everything and STR masterclass. And then, so I would, I would give that tool, especially to the people who were looking to go from SDR to SDR manager, they would get the job and.

They were like, okay, so now what I’m in the job, how do I do the job? I use this to get the job. How do I do the job? So one of my peers have reached out to me to ask that very same question. And so I had communicated with him via slack on some, some ideas on how to do the job, but I just figured again, instead of me just creating another course on how to be an SDR manager or just, you know, doing slack messages and LinkedIn posts.

Why not just make a compilation of everything that I’ve been telling people and put it in a book. And so that’s what I did with the latest book. Now that’s how you lead STR teams, because I just wanted to all that information to be in one platform and one book for people to be able to get access to it.

[00:03:57] Brad Seaman: W what’s the, what do you think the core mistake people make when managing an SDR?

[00:04:02] Emanuel Carpenter: The core mistake that they make with managing STR teams is that they think upfront that it’s going to be all about coaching. Like, and they’re going to just teach them everything that they did as an STR to be successful.

However, there’s so many other things that you have to do as an SDR manager. So, you know, yet you definitely coach you definitely train, but then there’s things like writing sequence. Talking to your peers outside of the organization, like, you know, meeting with sales, enablement and sales, operations, and demand gen and, reporting data back up the chain to executive management, you know, doing pipeline reviews, just being like a, the psychologist when, when BDRs and SDRs have personal issues, there’s like so many other things that you do outside of being.

That they don’t prepare for. So I think they have to prepare better. in that aspect,

[00:04:54] Brad Seaman: I’m sitting here laughing, just thinking about my, my 15 plus year history and the, the SDR space, the number of OCDish the number of positions that exist today that didn’t exist 50 years ago. And the number of departments, right.

You know, you had, you had a VP of sales and you had a bunch of inside sales reps. And now you got, and then you get a manager, right? You get an inside sales manager, but now you got a revenue operations, you got marketing, which marketing heading up, SDRs sales, heading up SDRs. I mean, there’s just a variety of, of different, so many different roles and positions that have sprung up.

you know, even just thinking about like, so do you remember the first time you heard the name Salesforce?

[00:05:36] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah. So the first time I heard the name of Salesforce, I want to say it was about 2004, maybe around, yeah. Around 2004, because they were new. They were like known for being strictly an online CRM.

And at the time I had worked in platforms like goldmine and act act was the platform that I was using as my CRM.

Yeah, but the fact that it was all online, that was like the, you know, that was the seller for them, that you can do it all online from anywhere. And, you know, they became the leader in the, in the

[00:06:15] Brad Seaman: space. I, I just remember, and I was listening to somebody talk about this, about this, the history of cloud. I just remember.

How everybody was scared that the company, the cloud, whoever was running the cloud was going to go out of business. Right. So if it was Microsoft and go, Hey, what if they go out of business, we lose our contact information. And then at some point it was a security risk to keep it onsite right now you’ve got to get it off.

Cause it’s like your, your, your data side can get hacked. So you gotta get it into, you gotta get it in the cloud. So, you know, cause it’s more, it’s safer. I got a whole team of people that are trying to protect that.

[00:06:49] Emanuel Carpenter: Exactly. Yeah. Yep.

[00:06:52] Brad Seaman: okay. Yeah. Sorry. I’m not, not to distract you by. I was just thinking of your you’re taking me down memory lane, just talk, you’re throwing out all these names.

And then I just started laughing to myself thinking about like all these positions that Devin didn’t that have sprung up, right. That didn’t exist. And, uh, then I started thinking about, you know, Hey, you got, you know, stuff like Salesforce and how it took, you know, 2008, you know, you went through the recession and all of a sudden.

You know, you’ll recognize this name, other people Siebel, which was, you know, rock, you know, they, they really had their foot in, on everything in. 24. You don’t even know what that is. Right. So anyways, it’s fun. It’s fun. So, yeah, I mean, there’s there’s so the one thing that I did, I feel like we haven’t covered enough on the podcast is just, you know, just kind of the blocking and tackling of, of sales management, sales, leadership.

Um, I think we have a tendency to, Roy talk about the tactical stuff and not about the intangible stuff. Like. Like leadership and what, what makes a good SDR leader and coach. And I think a lot of this is, you know, you highlighted, there’s a variety of departments that are, that have, sprung up, those people need to, to interact with.

And so, you know, what’s, what’s the one thing I guess. Okay. There’s, we’re just sorta kind of walking through this stuff. What’s the one thing you think most people do, right. Versus the one thing that they do, they do wrong. Is there something that everybody just gets, right?

[00:08:28] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah. I think the one thing that people get right is that they know that they have to coach.

I mean, that’s just part of the job and they understand that. So they’re prepared to coach STRs on how to send a good email, how to do role, do they do role play and they do like objection handling and you know, they listen to. They offer their feedback on recorded calls and they look at, they look, sometimes they look at emails and offer feedback on those things.

So they know how the coach, so they usually get that right. They understand that they have to coach in that role. but I think what they get wrong probably most often is that. Well, so a couple of things. One is that they have to understand that how important it is to report that data back up the chain to executive leadership.

They really care about all the minutia of, you know, the daily KPIs, the pipeline generated the qualified opportunities, the deals that results in revenue, which is another thing that a lot of newbies get wrong is that. They see the BDR manager role as someone who’s there to just fight for BDRs and be their champion.

Instead, they need to understand that the, the whole BDR team is a program designed to generate revenue. So if it’s not generating revenue, then there’s no point of it being a BDR. A lot of BDR managers think that, Hey, my BDRs are making qualified meetings there. They’re generating pipeline. We’ve done our share of the, of the job.

Right. And that was up to the AEs. However, those two teams have to work in sync. If those deals are not closing the CFO’s going to look at that program and say, well, you know, maybe we don’t need BDRs if it’s not resulting in revenue. Right. And so that’s something that being our managers need to understand that it has to result in revenue club.

For it to be a successful program. And then the other thing is just, like I said, the ag component of it, where you have to be, you have to understand, yeah, you’re going to be a champion for BDRs as well, but you have to understand the, the other component as well. Because a lot of times you’re one of the conflicts with SDRs and AEs, where an ag might say, Hey, this lead is not qualified enough.

It’s not meeting our expectations or an STR might say, You didn’t flip this opportunity. I can’t get paid on it because you didn’t change it to falsify opportunity. They need to understand both sides of the house where, you know, the perspective of the AEA and the perspective of the STR. But I think if a lot of people get promoted from STR to STR manager, without going into that AEA role, then they don’t really, truly understand both aspects of the job.

And also if you’re an STR manager, who’s never been an eight E how are you going to teach an STR manager? How to be. So for you to teach them the next step. So you’re preparing them for the next role anyway. So it’s super important for you to be an ag first, before you go on to the,

[00:11:33] Brad Seaman: well, I think that’s so that’s good insight.

I think the one thing is you’re sort of talking through this and I was starting to Google, this, this fact is, and I want to ask you this question, so. I think it’s really difficult to identify coaches and leaders. It can be very difficult, right? Because the indicator, the indicator we use is typically previous performance.

And so, one of the things that I read a stat one time when I was trying to Google it to see if I could validate it, but I feel pretty good about, or when that said it was, uh, it was, um, it was this. Three of the winningest coaches in NFL history never played a down and NFL football. So Lombardi, I believe Paul Brown and, um, and Walsh, the 49ers never played football, the NFL.

And so, you know, when we think about good coaches, we typically think about great players. And that’s not always the case. Right? There’s an obviously there’s that the adage, those who can’t learn, teach, but more importantly is like, you know, how do you find, how do you find those people? Because I think what typically happens is we go and we look at the highest performing reps and then we immediately say, Hey, they did it.

So they need to be coached. Now there’s two problems in my mind with that strategy. One is you’re now taking your top performer off the phone, making them productive and possibly putting them in a role that they don’t want to be true. the other problem with it is, you then are now creating a situation where you’re, Typically it’s like, copy this person.

Right. Do what this person did just copy. And we’re assuming that they know what they’re actually doing, consciously, right? Like a good, like a good app, like a good golfer may not be able to actually tell you what he’s doing. uh, you’re gonna get athlete may struggle to articulate what they’re physically doing.

So what are your thoughts on, what are your thoughts

[00:13:28] Emanuel Carpenter: on that hundred percent agree with that? And you Def. Thinking your top performer and you’re making him a manager. So now it’s like, you’re not getting that performance that from that top performer anymore. And then secondly, those people are typically not prepared to be in a leadership position just yet.

So you have to train them on how to be a leader. So, I mean, there’s things that they have to be like, for example, First of all, they just have to care. They have to care about, the individual contributors on their team. and that’s a big difference when you’ve been an individual contributor. All you have to do is care about yourself and doing well versus now caring about a team and their progress and their career progression and how they perform totally different mindset there.

But you have to care about them. you have to be a motivator, so you have the, you know, Find out what motivates those individual contributors to perform well? Is it, is it being a drill Sergeant and making sure that they do their daily tasks every day is, uh, showing them what they would get as a reward for being an individual contributor and doing that job well.

Oh, or is it something else? W what motivates them? You have to figure that out and you have to motivate them. You have to reward them publicly and discipline them privately. Some people thrive on positive motivation, some thrive on the negative reinforcement. Like if you don’t do this job well, then you might not have a position long if you don’t have

[00:14:55] Brad Seaman: really super funny, because I think leaders tend to either positively or negatively and they can’t understand or figure out how to do the opposite.

Right. So if you’re a positive reinforcement, it’s hard to be negative. If you’re negative, it’s super hard to be. Yeah. there’s a, there’s a hockey coach that I know that can only, I guarantee he writes all his emails and all capital letters. Like he only does one. He only knows how to do. Motivation.

[00:15:24] Emanuel Carpenter: It was yelling right yelling.

Oh yeah. Yeah. But yeah, those are like some of the things that just that managers need to learn and they need to learn to be motivators, maybe to have an infection process. So don’t just motivate and tell people how to do things, but you need to really dive into the data to make sure that they’re doing what they’re supposed to.

Like, for example, one of the big mistakes that FDR managers make is that. They assume that BDRs are, Sydney, good emails. And then they’re responding to prospects who respond to their emails. And that’s not always the case. You have to really dive into those emails and look at what’s being said, when the, you know, they’re, they’re giving objections over email, but a lot of SDR managers are not looking at that and offering advice on how to, how to fix that.

So. Like I said, inspection process are super important and that’s like, one of the main focuses of the book is that you need to have a coaching framework and you need to have a very thorough inspection process. So you look at the data and you determine based on what’s not happening and what’s not occurred.

What you need to do to fix that, that situation. Like, for example, if a BDR has a bunch of no shows, then you need to understand, okay, they have no shows. That means they’re inviting people to beading. They’re not coming to the meeting. There has to be a reason why. Right. So you dive into the data and you find out.

Well, maybe there was no business case for them to have a meeting. Maybe they were just saying yes, to get them off. Maybe they didn’t ask qualifying questions. Maybe they didn’t intrigue them with a way for them to leverage your software or whatever you’re selling, uh, to help them in their daily job. So you have to really dive into that and then maybe you’re not offering anything of significant value for them to want to have that meeting.

access to an expert, maybe a free coffee or something of that nature. So it’s all about that inspection process.

[00:17:19] Brad Seaman: I think the one thing that’s really overlooked too, is like, you know, I think it’s possible to have one of the things that I think is possible if you’re booking appointments, but you’re not showing up to the appointments.

So like I’m an SDR. I think there’s a real possibility. That is one of the things that could be happening. I think it’s overlooked is you and I. Really connect well, and I liked you and I booked the meeting cause I liked you. And now I realize you’re not going to be on that appointment. Right. So I’m not going to show to the appointment because the dynamics of the relationship change, I’ve never heard anybody talk about that, but I think that’s a reality.

And I’ll tell you what made me think about it. I got a call from G2 crowd. , the gal perked, my interest, I get on the phone, her and I are talking and immediately. A guy from their company. I highly dislike now gets on the phone. We’re done, man. I’m over. It’s like, I’m getting out. Um, I hope they’re listening.

[00:18:16] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah, because like all

[00:18:18] Brad Seaman: of a sudden the dynamics changed. Like I was interested, she perked my word and then all of a sudden this other guy gets in the whole dynamics of the conversation changed. And I was just like turned. I just like, I couldn’t. I just turned off. Like, I don’t want to keep going. I don’t want to go, go.

[00:18:34] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah. I’m, I’m amazed. I’m amazed at how many organizations don’t have that smooth handover process where the BDRs not only just joined and introduce the AAE, but they actually are active participants in that conversation. It’s, it’s amazing that they just booked the meeting and they’re done then.

[00:18:53] Brad Seaman: Yeah. I mean, I think you got a real, I mean, if it cause even a small nuance of why.

You know, Hey, you and I have a great conversation now. I see you’re not going to be on the phone. I mean, that could, that could turn me off. I mean, I think one of the challenge, one of the issues with appointment setting is that we, we try to accomplish a lot. We try to accomplish a lot, but one of the simple things could be, is like, there is a relational part of selling and when those relationships start changing, it is going to affect the ease of which you potentially.

Move someone through the stages of the process. And so I could have all the business needs. I mean, I could have no business need and super relational and you could maybe sell me, but if I have business need and it’s relational and you start changing the relationships that could affect, you continuing to go forward.

So I would say, Hey, if there’s no show rates, you gotta start asking yourself, you know, Hey, is it, could it be as simple as like, You know, this person’s really good at building relationships and then they’re clearly not getting on the phone. And so now the desire of this person to show up is going to go, or the prospects to show up could be low, no shows are complicated.

Right? I mean, it could be, I mean, I think there’s a lot. Do you think there’s a little bit of mystery to some of this? Like, you know, some people just get on the phone and they see. You listened to a call recording and there’s no substance or content that people show up. And then other times they sound great and they don’t show up in your show.

Confused.

[00:20:20] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah, definitely. Yeah. It’s like some people show up just to show up and be nice and they have no interest in what you sell and they have no buying influence at all. And then other people don’t shell it. Yeah. It’s just, well, and

[00:20:37] Brad Seaman: I think you got to careful with, with, no, I think no shows or this is not the way that I plan on this go, but I think it’s an important that we’re going to talk, let’s spend a second talking about it.

We gotta be careful with no shows. I think we assume, and there is some fair assumption here, and if I’m not showing up, I’m not interested. I do think that’s, I mean, 90% of the time, that’s true balance that. Some people are just busy. I mean, there’s some, there’s some people that, that just like are getting screwed because my world is changing.

Like I really am interested. It’s just like, for whatever reason, every time we go to book this meeting, it’s just like all hell breaks loose.

[00:21:15] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah. I got a slack, like 15 minutes before our meeting and I have to deal with that and I have to put out a fire or, you know, I have to deal with something else.

[00:21:25] Brad Seaman: I think he, at that point as an SDR, you just got to read.

It’s like you, you know, you just got to read the room and understand what’s going on now. Um, as we’re, as we’re talking about the sales management piece, I think there’s something that you said that I want to, um, make a comment about. I want to get your opinion. So your journey from SDR to sales manager, and I think I joked with you in the first, episode about, people, have you had some.

What are you, what is the word? I mean, I maybe have had too much coffee that I’m having a hard time. Remembering. You had like followers, you got a bunch of people that, like, you got a posse, you had like a posse of people that were hanging around you, right? Yeah. They’d be like, what about this? And what about that?

It’s like call it here’s some hangers. You you’re the video. They were just hanging, hanging around. how much, how important do you think that is to identify leaders in talents? Talent asking yourself. Okay. Does this person have a group of people that want to follow him or her?

[00:22:24] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah. Yeah. But that is really important.

I think. it’s funny. Cause I’ll talk a little bit about that in the book where my journey of being a leader started when I was a kid. I’m going to organize like what we have, like these electric football games with the big magnetic field and things like that for my age. Now, this was before like PlayStation and all that.

And so I organized these football and he’s where everyone brought their little with men and they put up on the mat. So I wouldn’t do that early. And then I would just like have flashes of leadership growing up, you know, in high school, I was the captain of the tennis team. I was the company. Uh, in the military, I was a squad leader.

And so I was, I was being a leader and showing leadership growing up until I finally got to the point where that displayed itself as in business, not everyone’s a leader and in some, and that’s okay if you’re not a leader, but I think it’s important that you have people who want to follow you, regardless of, just people who want to follow you in order for you to become a leader.

So like you said, people are already, they’re seeing your success. And so they’re asking you. Hey, how did you achieve this? How did you get that person to have a meeting with you when you know, other people could not, how did you write this particular email? How did you, how did you hit quota two weeks early?

So. Definitely you need those people to follow you because eventually that’s going to be your role as a manager. So yeah, you definitely have to establish that followership early on. Do

[00:23:54] Brad Seaman: you think people spend a lot of time looking at, so what’s the balance between accomplishment and followers? So I got a lot of followers, but I haven’t done anything versus I’ve done a lot and I don’t have any folders.

Like there’s some kind of, hi, there’s some, you know, graph to be built, right.

[00:24:14] Emanuel Carpenter: I don’t know. I haven’t thought about that. I wouldn’t imagine it’s probably like 80, 20, 80, 80% accomplishment and 20% courtship because I mean, you have to get the job

[00:24:23] Brad Seaman: done, right? You can’t no accomplishment, GAM zero. You can’t be nuts.

You have to at least be able to garner some respect.

[00:24:32] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah. If you’re not crushing it, people are following you. It’s like mama following somebody who can’t even hit quota. Right. So that’s definitely one of the kids I’ve

[00:24:40] Brad Seaman: taken financial advice from the guy with the 92 tourists. I love that. I’m not in savings.

I swear.

so, okay, now this is, this is good. man, this is great. Why? Like I said, I mean, I feel like there’s so little talked about just the sales management. Yeah. You know how to lead teams and leadership. Uh, we spent a lot of time on the tactical, what to say, who to say it to a very little time on, and look, this stuff is like, is, is softer and a little bit of it’s art.

And so it’s, uh, you know, what, how to say something, you know, coaching, I think is an event. So I, one time I, um, had asked somebody, yeah, You know, w we spent a lot of time talking about companies that have raised money and all this is like, you know, why don’t they write an article on a company that’s just brand, you know, for 20 years just really successful and build up an arsenal.

And the guy’s like, well, that’s not journalists. Journalism is about events and there’s no event in a 20 year, you know, buildup there’s no, there’s no climax. It’s. You know, for 20 years, I just did the right thing. And I think the same thing is true. Like, you know, sales management is, uh, is, is not an event based, topic.

Right.

[00:25:54] Emanuel Carpenter: So you’re right.

[00:25:57] Brad Seaman: So to talk about

[00:25:58] Emanuel Carpenter: it. So I still think that sales management, as you know, you have to have that growth mindset and to be able to continuously learn in order to be a good sales manager. I’ve since I become a manager, I’ve been through so many leadership courses that like sales academy, Sandler, uh, Lewis leadership, where you’re learning to bring your whole self into an organization.

And it continues. It goes on and on. He never stops. They’re always learning a better way to be a manager. Like for example, in Sandler, you learn how. If you’re gonna, if you’re glad to coach someone that you need to have, like, a five to one ratio, five compliments to one coaching, you have to motivate them first. And then for them to be open to thinking that, uh, that criticism or constructive criticism. Yeah. So again, it’s, uh, it’s just, I think with everything it’s just ongoing growth mindset, continuing to learn, continuing to be better, in order to be a good coach and a good

[00:27:05] Brad Seaman: manager.

Yeah. Yeah. I think, you know what being a good coach requires you to be, you know, a chameleon of sorts because you can’t motivate everybody’s different. I mean, you got to understand what causes somebody to tick. And then you got to get, you got to, it’s kinda like the, you know, be a good, I think being a good coach, like being a good parent, right?

I mean, you get, you get a hand, you know, you start having a handful of kids. You start realizing none of them are coming out. None of them, zero of them are processing the information the same way. So you have an, a how, uh, event in the house or event, you know, family event and everybody based on their personality and how they view the world as accepting is doing that differently.

Like the house is a mess. It needs to get. you know, immediately my, one of my children, you know, just, you know, starts getting on the phone and calling maid services. Like you don’t have authority to do that. You can’t call them back. You can’t go, man, you don’t get to get on the phone and start to out the bank account.

What are you doing? But they all process it differently based on their personalities. You know, one, one starts making phone calls. One starts, you know, cleaning. Cause they’re going to get in trouble. One star, you know, it’s like ever in the same thing as a manager, right? Every one of you. Um, reports, it has got a personality that’s processing the world differently and you gotta be able to understand.

That’s why I think personality profiles are so important, you know, I don’t, I’m sure you’re running those as part of your system. I think it’s just super important to know. What makes people tick. and because the reality is sales, good salespeople come in all kinds of different personalities. There’s a handful of personalities that probably are not going to be as successful as sales.

but once you start getting good salespeople, you start realizing they all come in different shapes and sizes, and you gotta really be able to, to understand what makes them tick. And then to figure, you know, once you can understand that, then you can figure out motivation.

[00:29:02] Emanuel Carpenter: Agreed. I think that starts with your very first meeting with your direct reports.

You’re asking, how do you like to be coached? how do you learn? Do you learn just by watching videos or doing the general?

[00:29:16] Brad Seaman: I’m going to say to you, Hey, a manual. I really like somebody to stick their foot up. My rear, my hind Dale. I always showed up. If you, if you bombed out the day

[00:29:27] Emanuel Carpenter: before. Right. I actually have

my bosses. I would like them to really just tell it like it is and, and really, you know, give it to me, like, let me know what I’m doing wrong and just kick my butt when I’m not doing well. I mean,

[00:29:43] Brad Seaman: that’s exciting for good. Have a good player. I mean, you want something, you actually want somebody to say, Hey, I want you to tell me and look, I think the, and this is like being a good sport.

Um, which I, which I am probably not a good sports coach. I can’t, I can’t watch a game and pull out some people have the ability to, or maybe here’s a good example because I was talking about this this morning on another podcast. I watch a, um, I listen to a podcast called the founder’s podcast by a guy named David syndrome.

If you have any entrepreneurial bone in you, I would get on download this kind of hard to find, but David, Sandra, the founder’s podcast and he basically reads books on entrepreneurs. Any, any breaks, he takes all the business concepts out, all the things that you should learn about and puts it into it’s.

It’s like a little, it’s like a little, uh, you know, bull sermon. He just takes it all out. He puts it into the digestible information and he does this every week and it’s phenomenal. So great. If he ever quit doing it, I just put them on payroll and make him keep doing it. It’s the best $90 I’ve ever spent.

But I read a book that, I read a book called the sugar cane. About the guy, about a guy in Cuba who really ran the sugar markets and the book goes through, kind of the ups and downs, uh, uh, his business for Ray and through the different, you know, dictatorships and government entities and all the ups and downs.

And I read this book and I was like, oh, it’s interesting. But I don’t, if David, I remember saying this to myself, I’m like, if David read this, I just don’t know that he there’s a lot of business principles in this, in this. And then I saw last week, he put it on line and he had read it. He just happened to read it and I listened to it, dirty, crushed it.

I’m like I did it here. And maybe it’s because I listened to it and didn’t read it. But he was able to take stuff out of his book that I just never even heard. Like I did not hear that in the book. He said it. And I remember reading it, but I didn’t, wasn’t like, oh, this is a great, like, I don’t know if I would have highlighted that.

And so I think it takes the point is I think some people are really good at watching something and then being able to distill things out of it. And then it’s being a good teacher. Right? Can you watch an event? Can you grab the highlights? Can you get them into some kind of digestible, snippet? And then can you articulate them to your, and I think a lot of this probably comes down to knowledge and understanding, right?

If you watch a ton of tennis, you’re probably going to be able to identify bad, better. You’re going to be a better, if you’re a, if a steward of the game, you’re going to be able to pull principals out that a non steward of the game could not. so, you know, so yeah, so I think, you know, but it, it is a skill.

Some people are naturally good at watching something, anything, and then being able to pull out pieces of it. And coach somebody on other people can like, my kid plays hockey. I asked one of his coaches what he could work on. And he gave me like a spreadsheet. I asked the other coach and he gave me like one, one thing.

[00:32:44] Emanuel Carpenter: Yeah. You’re right, right under it. Right on the head. Yeah. Yeah. Everyone’s a little bit different from people like to read. Some people like to listen to something and watch a video. Some people just want to do it first or some people want to watch you do it first and then they do it. So everyone’s a little bit.

And it’s important to ask that question upfront. Yeah.

[00:33:02] Brad Seaman: Yeah. well, Emmanuel, I th I love, I love it. Let’s keep having you on. Let’s just make you, let’s make you a regular, so this is good, man. I love talking to you is we want to thank you so much for your time. And, where can people find you at?

If somebody wanted to track you down?

[00:33:21] Emanuel Carpenter: Really simple. My website is just my name, Emmanuel carpenter.com. as well as you can find me on LinkedIn as well, just Google Emanuel, carpenter, LinkedIn. You’ll find

[00:33:31] Brad Seaman: me. All right. Well, thanks again. I love it.